Posted by  Ed Laugen, Dunedin, FL on 10/07  at  10:00 PM

Brett,
Can I assume, that if you had to pick right now a winner in the UF@Vanderbilt game, you’d take Vanderbilt?  You ranked Vanderbilt higher and are playing at home. Or are you encouraged to vote a certain way based on W-L records. Both mindsets can be justified so I hope I don’t sound critical; I’m just inquiring about voter mindsets.

Posted by  Ed Laugen, Dunedin, Fl on 10/07  at  09:50 PM

Brett,

Pardon me if this is a stupid question, but I’m not sure what the poll is supposed to represent.  Is it supposed to represent what teams have had the better season thus far?  Or is supposed to represent the opinions of the voters of which team is straight-up better? Or something else(their last game)? For example, after week 5, USF at 5-0 was seemingly having a better season than UF and Georgia and was ranked higher than them.  If a voter ranks a team higher than another, does that mean the voter thinks if the two teams play each other(on neutral ground), the higher ranked team should win(or be at least favored)? Or is it more USF has not lost; team x has; therefore, I rank USF higher (even though I think team X would beat USF).

Posted by  Jon McKee, SRQ on 10/07  at  09:50 AM

Brett

Quit citing Sagarin’s ratings. I have watched his so-called computer ratings carefully over the last few years.

USF finished 07 in Sagarin in the 20’s.  When his 08 rating came out USF dropped into the 40’s.  Thats total BS subjective Jeff Sagarin manipulating the rankings by subjectively setting them in the preseason.

The whole computer thing is such a crock of CRA* because eveyone of them subjectively starts the year out.

What was Sagarin’s criteria for having USF down in the 40’s when everyone else had them in their top 25?

FWIW the BCS averages 6 different computer rankings..

And I’m a big USF fan but I don’t believe they could beat Florida right now so UF should be ahead of them, and frankly I hate UF.

Posted by  Teresa, Boca Raton on 10/07  at  07:32 AM

I can send you the tape. It was right after the actual broadcast started - after the pregame show. As far as having the same people, that’s just great - gives us a lot to look forward to. Good thing the players can’t hear them. I guess I should be glad that we aren’t playing Syracuse on a Thursday. They would pick them over us, too.

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/06  at  08:40 PM

Teresa, I’ll take your word for it, but I would be surprised that an ESPN announcer would say they wouldn’t have chosen this game to broadcast. They might admit that privately, but not over the air. And, as far as the Cincy game, you’ll have the same announcing ESPN crew that you did for the Pitt game.

Posted by  Teresa, Boca Raton on 10/06  at  07:09 PM

Not a bit surprised they left us out. At one point they said that this was not a game they would have chosen for Thursday. They said and I quote “Pitt is not ranked and South Florida shouldn’t be.” Let’s hope they aren’t the broadcasters when we play Cincinnati on 10/30.

Even if USF were to beat USC or Oklahoma they would call it a fluke. Face it. USF will never get the respect they deserve.

Go Bulls and don’t worry - your fans respect you even if the broadcasters don’t.

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/06  at  06:12 PM

Teresa, I’m not suggesting James or Fowler are more - or less - qualified than any of the other AP voters, only it was somewhat surprising that both of them left USF out of the Top 25. I think they do have a pretty good read of the national scene, they’ve got to with their jobs, and they do present a pretty good national read on USF. And, yes, I was not able to listen to the game off TV.

Posted by  Teresa Higgins, Boca Raton, Florida on 10/06  at  05:07 PM

Brett said ESPN’s Craig James and Chris Fowler, who both worked the USF-Pitt game, ... They clearly don’t think much of USF.
If you stayed home and watched the game on ESPN you would know that the above is true. They were slamming USF even before the game began. I don’t think that the broadcasters should be picking sides. They should be neutral responding to the plays as they happen no matter which team is the playmaker but they did not have one nice thing to say. They were obviously pulling for PITT to win. Even when Grothe made the one spectacular run, they didn’t get excited like they should have. Even Lou H. was slamming us in the pregame. I lost a lot of respect for the broadcasters that night.

Posted by  Chris, Florida on 10/06  at  04:15 PM

If you throw out the Kansas win as a quality one merely because they are ranked(Kansas squeeked by then #93 Iowa St. 35-33 and haven’t beaten anyone good), can anyone really honestly say have played like a Top 25 team??

Posted by  Chris, Florida on 10/06  at  04:15 PM

Looks like its time to do my week poer index rankings to help all you “genius’” understand why Brett has them ranked #23. I do agree that Kansas is ranked waaay too high and so do most of the computer polls which facter quality or win against strength of opponents actually played. I don’t think a team should keep it’s position just because it pulls out a victory. Whether they win or lose a team should be evaluated by there performance relative to that particular game as well as their current entire body of work up to that point in the season. I think Sagarin has USF at #42 and Kansas at #44, so in alot of circles..Brett was being generous.

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/06  at  03:06 PM

Ari, again: Tennessee, Arkansas are not good, but they’re better than FIU and UCF. UF thumped those teams. USF was in a struggle to beat FIU and UCF. So why should USF be ranked ahead of Florida? Because it beat Kansas. At home. By 3. On the last play of the game? When UF lost I dropped UF to No. 14, four spots behind USF. And comparing the Pitt-USF, Ole Miss-UF games. Pitt dominated USF, outgaining the Bulls by 129 yards and overcoming two turnovers and a blocked punt for a TD. Florida outgained Ole Miss by 120 yards and lost three turnovers! But I still dropped UF for the loss. So USF should be ranked ahead of UF because it beat Kansas at home by 3?

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/06  at  02:57 PM

DT, this is second part of answer below (couldn’t fit too many characters): Last year, USF was ranked above Cincy and Cincy won the head-to-head. In fact, it cost Cincy the Sun Bowl bid because it took the higher ranked BCS team. I know if Team A beats Team B it should be ranked ahead of Team B, but unfortunately it’s not that simple sometimes. FWIW, Sagarin’s ratings has USF ranked No. 42 and KU No. 44, so I guess my No. 23 for USF is pretty generous.

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/06  at  02:54 PM

DT, I apologize for taking so long to answer. Anyway, as I mentioned previously I should have dropped KU some this week. Does USF’s win mean it should be ranked above Kansas. Well, yes and no. I don’t think you should blindly put USF over KU. Yes, USF beat KU, but the Bulls were 3-4 point favorites, won by 3 on the game’s last play and the total yards were nearly identical (USF 458, KU 434). Difference was KU’s 1 turnover. So while USF won on the field, the computer rankings basically look at the game as a tie or tossup. If I put USF over KU all season, does that mean I should rank Pitt above USF the rest of the season?

Posted by  Ari Hinkelberger, Gates of Heaven on 10/06  at  01:54 PM

Brett,
I think its very honorable that you put your ballot up and explain your position.  Its more then most can say.

But Brian makes some good points with respect to where you have the gators.

Ole Miss is not good.  Tenn is not good.
Ark is terrible..  Lots of names, not very good football

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/06  at  01:42 PM

Brian, the Sagarin poll “is valid” this week. The BCS doesn’t start its rankings until next week, but Sagarin’s poll starts when the season does. And I’ll play along: USF has one more quality win that UF. So that means forget the rest of the season’s results? USF has an 8-point win over a FIU team that lost by 30 to KU and lost by 42 to Iowa. USF has a 7-point win over a UCF team that lost by 27 to Boston College and lost by 45 to UTEP. At least Florida beat the so-called bad teams by significant margins. USF was in a dogfight with its dog opponents. And 2 of Ole Miss’ 3 losses are to ranked teams - Wake by 2 on a last second FG and Vandy by 6. Pitt lost to freaking Bowling Green.

Posted by  Brian, Sanford, FL on 10/06  at  12:16 PM

UF has beaten several teams by over 21 points. 

Well, Hawaii also lost to Oregon state by 35 and they lost to San Jose State.  Beating them not impressive.

Arkansas lost to several teams by over 21.  Alabama beat them by 35. Texas beat them by 42.  They barely beat UL-Monroe (1pt victory) and they nearly lost to the 1AA team they played (4pt victory).

So, UF’s schedule is “#47” according to a poll that isn’t considered valid by the BCS for another week.

Well, I still contend USF has more quality wins than UF one to zero.

And lost to a better team.

What’s the comparison?  UF beat a bunch of really bad teams by a lot, but lost to a bad team.

USF squeaked by some bad teams, beat a good team, and lost to a good team.

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/06  at  11:05 AM

Brian, you want to compare USF and UF’s schedules? UF’s SOS is 47, USF 106 says Jeff Sagarin’s computer rankings, used in the BCS. Also UF hasn’t played a I-AA and all of its W’s are by at least 21 points. USF has only one I-A victory by more than 21 points. So while USF has played an easier schedule than UF, the Bulls have been less impressive in their wins than Florida.

Posted by  Jon McKee, SRQ on 10/06  at  11:01 AM

Shirley, I mean Brett

My comment is more about overrating Vanderbilt.  You can’t have it both ways.  Vandy moves up by barely winning at home over the team you’re dropping out.  Makes a lot of sense…

Posted by  Brian, Sanford, FL on 10/06  at  09:27 AM

I totally agree that losing at home to 1 loss Pittsburgh is way worse than losing at home to 3 loss Ole Miss.

And beating (2-3) Tennessee… umm… (2-3) Arkansas… well… (2-3) Miami… (2-3) Hawai’i are all better than beating an “over-rated” 4-1 Kansas.

You probably should have the Gators at #1.  Now they are an impressive team…

Posted by  DT, tampa,fl on 10/06  at  09:02 AM

I think we are all anxiously awaiting for the explanation for ranking Kansas ahead of USF.

Posted by  jeffrey saff, annapolis, md on 10/06  at  06:33 AM

Brett,

As Rosanne Rosanna Danna used to say on Saturday Night Live-"never mind.”

I thought Navy had only one (1) loss.

Thank you.

Posted by  jeffrey saff, annapolis, md on 10/06  at  06:30 AM

Brett,

How could you not have voted for Navy in the Top 25?

They beat WF on the road and then go on the road and beat Air Force.

Please explain.

Thank you.

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/05  at  11:56 PM

Nabeel, three of USF’s wins are against non-BCS teams. Two of those (against UCF and FIU) were by eight points or less. The margin of victory and strength of schedule plays a part in the rankings. Since teams have a different strength of schedule, it’s not fair to simply rank a team because they won. Jon, yes, I’m serious and don’t call me Shirley. I mentioned in an earlier blog post that I don’t believe in ranking teams this early with two losses over a one-loss or unbeaten team. If 2-loss teams Auburn, Wisconsin, Oregon, etc., are that good, they’ll keep winning and return to my Top 25. Just not right now.

Posted by  Brett McMurphy,  on 10/05  at  11:47 PM

Jamie and Tyler, you’re right, I probably should have dropped Kansas down in the rankings. What made it difficult was you had four teams between No. 18 and 24 that lost and five new teams in the poll. Chris, I didn’t rank Ole Miss above Florida because Ole Miss had multiple losses. Obviously, there isn’t a “set” number a team drops after a loss. While the majority - perhaps every USF fan - is upset I ranked the Bulls 23rd, I have ranked USF higher than its AP ranking 4 of 7 weeks (1 week my ranking tied with USF’s AP rank). What would be more troubling if I was a USF fan was that ESPN’s Craig James and Chris Fowler, who both worked the USF-Pitt game, both dropped USF out of the top 25. They clearly don’t think much of USF.

Posted by  Jon McKee, SRQ on 10/05  at  06:48 PM

Brett,

Vandy at 8, are you serious? And then dropping Auburn all the way out.  If Auburn is that bad then Vandy can’t be that good.  Think about it.

It shocks me how poorly prepared USF is for many of their games.  I just don’t get what they worked on all week, and the secondary isn’t getting better, its getting worse.

I heard during the game the announcer say that OC Gregory told him they don’t have an offense style, just a bunch of plays.  Well it shows.  Good teams have a “style”, an idenity on offense.  Time to get one.